We all know the economy is experiencing a crisis. We all know it's critical to our country to stabilize it. But why do we, the people, have to point fingers at who is responsible? As far as I'm concerned, both parties are responsible for our economy going down. Almost everybody agrees on that, except the very close-minded. But now we're arguing about which party is MORE to blame?
Why are we doing this? Shouldn't we be a little more concerned about our fellow Americans who are suffering from this mess? If you guys want to point fingers, that's fine. But that won't change the fact that it happened. I'm not going to be so obsessed with my political party divides that I start playing the blame game.. and I find it sad that most Americans seem so obsessed with pitting this economic issue on someone that they're completely losing focus on what it SHOULD be on... Changing it.
That's all I have to say.
Comments (25)
The government, the Federal Reserve, and the candidates can all go jump off a bridge and STOP trying to fix it. It will correct itself when the bad debt is purged.
@ReformedPatriot - So True!!! I really wish people would realize that. I'm just upset at the bailouts. But if you do want to know who's fault it is, it's the companies' and those who took out the crap loans faults. If they didn't do that, there would be no problem.
I'm loving this situation. It's nice to see the rich squirm lol
@grim_truth - I agree mostly with what is being said here. The one thing I have to say is this-we have to start being "agreeable" and tell people "no". It seems to always start with the housing market and it trickles down-it never would have happened if they wouldn't have been giving people loans who shouldn't have them. Partially it was greed-but partly it was the government. They created all of these "special loan programs": zero down, interest only, 80/20s, marginal credit...so that more lower income, minorities could qualify. The mortgage companies had to comply to stay competitive and here we are-with bad loans, forclosures everywhere, and more people everyday who can't make their payments.
@grim_truth - Ummm, it's not just the rich. Try having your retirement in a 401K, being a year away, and seeing most of it's value lost. Try seeing the value of the fund for your kid's college cut by so much. Try being someone who had their home foreclosed on and stressing about how you are going to take care of your family. There are real people suffering, and you are "loving this situation"? Nice.
@soapbox_sara - So it was all the loans? It had nothing to do with the fact that people's real income has actually gone down over the last 5 years? I mean how DARE those minorities have a chance to buy a home, right? That could mean actual black people moving into your neighborhood! The government, by the way, did not create those loans. The government, a Republican congress, deregulated banks, which allowed them to create those loans as they pleased. I know Amanda doesn't like this "blame game", but don't the people that have been in power for 8 years, and in control of congress for 6 of those years, deserve some blame?
@ReformedPatriot - That's funny, Herbert Hoover said it would just fix itself too.
@megank1991 - I wouldn't care if my neighborhood was full of black people. I just care that people are getting loans that they can PAY FOR. The government DID create these loan progams and people are losing their homes for the simple fact that they shouldn't have had them in the first place. It really is both parties fault. I love that black people own their own homes. I love that white people own their own homes. I work in the buisness, I LOVE it when people buy houses, but only when they can pay for them 5 years down the road. My prents bought their house in the eighties and 2 years later the housing market totally crashed but because they were smart about buying, they kept their house. God forbid you only buy what you can afford, if it feels good do it, right?
@soapbox_sara - I still don't understand? What does the people being black have to do with it? I mean you said, "lower income, minorities". Is the issue of being able to pay back a loan inherently a matter of the color of your skin?
@megank1991 - Of course your ability to pay back your loan is not based on your skin color! The reason the loan programs were created however is because of nationality. There weren't a high enough percentage of minorities getting mortgage loans because statistically speaking they have lower credit scores, and lower incomes-that's not racist, that's a fact (but the reason behind THAT may be racism, but that's an entirely different issue) So in order for things not to be that way they "changed the rules" so to speak. They changed income, credit score, and debt ratio qualifications and it became a loan giveaway (for everyone, not just minorities) and the market boomed. Now the debt is catching up with those people and that combined with the high taxes to small buisnesses (which the liberals want to increase) and the greed and bs going on on wallstreet-people are losing their jobs and their houses are being forclosed on. The housing market never would have gotten so bad if they wouldn't have changed the guidelines to promote lending to minorities.
@megank1991 - @soapbox_sara - I feel I should mention that these loans were not made to attract minorities, they were made to attract lower income families and peoples. It just happens that in this country, most of the people of lower income just happen to be minorities because of a large amount of racism.
Also, one of President Bush's policies was for every family in the United States to own a home, and the congress deregulation of banks and Bush's push for this has helped create the crisis that we are in._Anthony_
@megank1991 - pertaining to the bank deregulation, are you talking about the Gramm-Leach-Bliley Act in 1999? republicans drafted the legislation, but a around half of the democratic house favored it. i dont know if clinton supported it, but it was irrelevent since it got at 2/3 majority vote because of the bipartisan support
i blame everyone and their dog
@megank1991 - If someone lost their home in this mess, I'm sorry, they deserved it. They should have read the loan contract and made sure they could afford their home. I purchased my home around the same time many of these other folks did. I still have my home and will continue to have my home. Before someone starts talking about something they know about, I make right at the median income for New Jersey, wich has one of the highest costs of living for any state.
If you lost most of your 401k because of this mess, you are also a moron, as it means you had your money clearly in the wrong sectors. Most, if not all, 401k plans allow you different funds to invest your money in. My savings plan (very similar to a 401k) has lost nothing because of where I invested my money.
The people suffering are suffering because of their own mistakes. And yes, I love it. I was born into near poverty. I worked my ass off my whole life to get where I am now. I've made mistakes and have learned from them. I educated myself on how to save and invest. I have no college education, as I could not afford it when I graduated high school. Again, I make very near the median income in New Jersey. Not to pull a politician move, but I AM the epitomy of middle class America. If someone can't afford a house, so what? They need to go out and find a better job. I did. So did all of my family.
We're in the mess we're in because of greed. People wanting something for nothing, or very little. And this greed ranges from the bottom to the top. Until we fix that, this cycle will continue up and down. Until our tax dollars are used to help the lazy and greedy I will continue my smug attitude about these situations. If folks would just own up and work a little harder to get what they want instead of demanding it, we wouldn't have these problems. But no, because some folks wanted a house, but didn't want to put forth the extra work like I have done my whole life, my hard earned tax dollars are being spent to give them what they want and to bail them out. This includes the banks as well as those who irresponsibly took out the bad loans for houses they couldn't afford.
@grim_truth - OK, then. I guess I hope that if something bad happens to you or someone in your family like getting laid off or something, that someone has some compassion for you. Have a nice day.
You guys are doing exactly what I said everyone was doing. Blaming.
Sigh.
@bamfness__xx - Well there is some blame to be placed, I think. That doesn't mean the problem doesn't get addressed, and it seems like they are trying to address it. But whatever, I am just stating my opinion. If that is blaming then OK.
@megank1991 - I'm not mad at you or anything. I'm probably not even thinking straight because of everything that happened.
I just want America to come together for once.
The problems in the markets with all the bad loans do need to be addressed. But the blame just cannot be held to the lenders. Those borrowing the money were just as guilty, as if they had read their contracts, they would have known they couldn't afford the house. I did.
But as far as if something bad happens to me, I don't expect sympathy. I expect to get off my rear and go find a new job. I've been laid off several times in my life, and I got right back into the job searches. I've never been unemployed for more than a few weeks, and I always had enough saved up to keep paying my bills, with one exception. At one time, I was literally two days away from living in my car. I did not blame anyone but myself. It was because of a few dumb desicions, but I got a job just in time. Everyone in my family has been laid off at one time or another, with the exception of my littlest brother, who's still in college. We always bounced back and laid blame on no one. It happens.
The problem doesn't lie with laying blame, but accepting it. No one wants to accept the blame. It's really not about blame, it's about responsibility. If people would just own up to the responsibilities of their poor decisions, this world would be so much different. And there is no one out there who can't make it in this nation. If I can go from two days from homeless, to being married, 5 kids, and owning a home in less than 10 years, anyone can. No special favors were ever offered to me, nor did I ever ask for them. When I made my mistakes, I took responsibility for them. That's why I'm where I am today. Sure, if it weren't for my mistakes, or if I placed blame and asked for assistance I didn't deserve, I might be better off financially, but that's now how it should be done. You work for what you want, you get what you want. If you continue to skirt responsibility and keep relyin on others to bail you out, you will always need to be bailed out.
An ex-friend of mine is the perfect example. In his thirties, this man has nothing to his name. He welches off of everyone and expects everyone to fix his messes. His parents always bailed him out of his problems, and that's why he wil always need someone to bail him out. It's a cycle that will never end. That's why I'm no longer friends with him. I work hard to get what I want, I don't need him asking me for help because he's a dolt.
I know I sound harsh and brash when it comes to these issues, but when people make poor decisions, I'm tired of everyone else having to foot the bills. Especially when the annual price tag of welfare comes in at over $1 TRILLION.
@grim_truth - I said compassion. Compassion doesn't mean giving anything to anyone. Compassion means recognizing that something bad happened to another human being and, at least, hoping that things will turn out better for them. You don't hope for that at all, instead you seem to take joy in bad things happening to people, whether it be their own fault or not. This has nothing to do with taking ownership for one's self, it has to do with the way you see other human beings and to be honest, the qualities that you display are not very attractive. And for someone who claims to be a Catholic, I think that you should spend some time studying Scripture. Luke 10, 25-37 might be a good place to start. You could read Ephesians 4, 32 or 1 Peter 3, 8 too. I know you said that you wouldn't expect sympathy, but I would have it for you anyway because I recognize that to do so is to walk with the Lord. In the end, there are more important things in life than money.
@megank1991 - The parable of the Good Samaritan refers to victims. These people were victims of their own greed. If maybe these people would have followed the advice you give me, they would not be in the positions they are now in.
I never said I didn't have compassion for those who lost their jobs through no fault of their own. I said I don't expect it for me. But I find it hard to give compassion to people who lose their jobs and do nothing to find a new one. I do not, however, have compassion for those who lose their homes or investments because of greed. That's like having compassion for someone who committed multiple murders and was only sentenced to 5 years. Do I take joy in what happens to these people? Yes, I do. Why? Because it means that they are recieving their punishment. They got greedy and paid for it.
These people are placing their greed above all else. Luke 12:15, "And he said unto them, Take heed, and beware of covetousness: for a man's life consisteth not in the abundance of the things which he possesseth."
They are also never satisfied with their possessions. I would love to find out how many other needless possessions these folks obsessed over. Isaiah 56:11, "Yea, they are greedy dogs which can never have enough, and they are shepherds that cannot understand: they all look to their own way, every one for his gain, from his quarter."
Now with the bailouts, they get something for free. Those who live off of welfare for years know they will alwas get something for free without working for it. Proverbs 21:25, "The desire of the slothful killeth him; for his hands refuse to labour. He coveteth greedily all the day long: but the righteous giveth and spareth not."
And of course, they put on a false face and both sides are claiming to be victims. They all claim to just wanting to help, or just wanting a home. Luke 11:39, "And the Lord said unto him, Now do ye Pharisees make clean the outside of the cup and the platter; but your inward part is full of ravening and wickedness."
Again, these people who lost their homes because of their greed, and the companies who lent them the money out of greed should get what they deserve. Not a bailout. I have no compassion for those who do not want to work for anything. Again, it falls to responsibility, which is even laid out in the Good Book:
"But let all things be done properly and in an orderly manner" (1 Corinthians 14:40)
They should have read the loan contracts: "Prepare plans by consultation" (Proverbs 20:18)
The loan companies should have used their heads a little better as well, they knew these people wouldn't be able to pay it back: "Any enterprise is built by wise planning, becomes strong through common sense, and profits wonderfully by keeping abreast of the facts" (Proverbs 24:3-4, TLB)
Neither side did any of the above.
"The wicked borrows and does not pay back, but the righteous is gracious and gives"
(Psalm 37:21)
I think this one sums up why I feel the way I do the best:
"But if anyone does not provide for his own, and especially for those of his household, he has denied the faith, and is worse than an unbeliever" (1 Timothy 5:8)
"The wise man saves for the future, but the foolish man spends whatever he gets"
(Proverbs 21:20, LB)
But why do I take a bit of joy in what has happened to these greedy people?
"The treacherous will be caught by their own greed" (Proverbs 11:6)
They were caught by their own greed. Unfortunately, many of these people and the corrupt companies who lent to them will be getting bailouts, and will not fully be caught by their greed.
@Complete_loser - wrong, wrong, wrong. Here is a fact for you: congress makes the laws-the president doesn't. Since the democrats have controlled the congress for the majority of the last 63 years guess whose is at "fault" here. The "subprime mortgage crisis" is largely the democrats fault.
"the risk-taking was (their) idea — and the idea of all the other Democrats, along with a handful of Republicans, who over the past 30 years have demonized lenders as racist and passed regulation after regulation pressuring them to make more loans to unqualified borrowers in the name of diversity."*
Look up provisions such as CRA (Community Reinvestment Act) and ACORN (represented by Barack Obama I might add).
Because all of the pushing from the radical democrats; HUD (the department of housing and urban development) petitioned (and very literally forces) Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac to purchase these high risk loans. And look at us now, we're screwed.
Just because president Bush wanted everyone to own a home doesn't mean he is responsible for creating loan programs to subprime borrowers. The president SHOULD want everyone to live the American Dream-but they can't force it to happen.
See, and that's funny that you think there is "so much racism" because I think the people most disciminated against in this country are single, white, males but that's an entirely different argument. Just because you're an American, doesn't mean you're entitled. Sorry, Charlie
*http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080922092836AAk8Pni
@soapbox_sara - It doesn't matter that the Democrats have controlled congress for majority of the last 63 years, they have controlled congress since 1994, around the time that the push for deregulation came about.
All of the things that you have said do not change the fact that this was not targeted at minorities per say, but at lower income families who just happen to be poor because of institutionalized racism. You may not like to believe that fact, but racism in the government played a significant role in Blacks living and staying in poverty. After WWII, when many of the soldiers returned home, white soldiers were given GI bills to go to school, reduced mortgage rates to get houses, medical benefits, and loads of other things for serving their full time in the military. Soldiers that were Native American, Chinese, Hispanic, and Black were given reasons why they were not able to get these benefits. Whites were able to go to school, move out of the city and into suburbs, thus giving them a better station in life. Blacks were forced to stay in the city and because of poorly financed schools and richer neighborhoods refusing to sell to people because they were black, they stayed in poverty and did not receive full equality. Thus, racism has played a role in why much of the black population today is still in poverty. Also, if you believe that white men are the most discriminated against, you are delusional. White men, because of their skin tone, are generally given a more positive rating when pictures of them are shown to people. Do not misunderstand, there is discrimination against white people, but they are not being lynched in the streets, or being denyed loads of jobs by any means.
Your thought processes are flawed when you say the president should want everyone to have a home and he is not responsible for the bubble bursting. The president can put sway on the government, especially if his party controls the congress, which, during the Bush admin, it did for 6 of his 8 years. Also, he could have easily vetoed any of the bills that came his way pushing for more deregulation, which he didn't. Also, Bush started a war and lowered taxes without a way to pay for it, thus push up unemployment and inflation, causing the value of a dollar to fall, and people's real dollar income to fall, despite the fact that people make more money now than they did 10 years ago.
Disagree with me, I welcome it, but please do not talk at me rather than to me.
_Anthony_
@Complete_loser - One thing I have been taught is that I can never really understand racism because I have never been on the receiving end of it. I agree with that completely, by the way; there is no way I can ever get it. She is going to see this as all because loans were given to minorities, as if no white people took out these loans...please get a grip on reality!!! That is simply the lens through which she sees the world and that is why I have decided it isn't worth discussing this with her anymore. Anyway, you make a lot of good points. It's easy for someone to say the playing field should be level for everyone now when you have been playing on green grass all along and the others have been playing on rocks and dirt.
@megank1991 -
"It's easy for someone to say the playing field should be level for everyone now when you have been playing on green grass all along and the others have been playing on rocks and dirt."I like that, I might use that someday.
_Anthony_
@Complete_loser -
Just be sure I get my share if it gets printed on a tee shirt and becomes famous.
AMEN!